Ubuntu Demon\’s blog

October 31, 2007

I’m very sorry!

Filed under: english — ubuntudemon @ 11:53 am

I’m very sorry! I don’t want to spam planet.ubuntu.com

I just discovered this : if I edit an old post the timestamp in the rss feed gets updated and bumps my post to the top of planet.ubuntu.com. I use wordpress.com so I can’t edit the source code. I thought this just happened with my latest post but apparently it happens with al my posts. Does anyone have any idea how to fix this ? In the meantime I won’t be editting posts.

The last post I made regarding the harddrive problem is : Ubuntu is NOT causing aggressive power management

I’m a big fan of Ubuntu. I don’t want to see Ubuntu hurt because it’s not Ubuntu who is setting these aggressive power management defaults. I won’t blog again about this problem until new information arises.

15 Comments »

  1. afaik, its a problem in the planet software..

    Comment by pirast — October 31, 2007 @ 12:16 pm

  2. iCan digg it!

    Comment by Thunk Different. — October 31, 2007 @ 2:03 pm

  3. This bug is EXTREMELY annoying, yet no one who can fix it seems interested in doing so. I am not a programmer, but I have see how some simple logic changes can fix this problem. See my post:

    http://useopensource.blogspot.com/2007/07/when-is-it-wrong-to-fix-typo-on-planet.html

    Tristan

    Comment by Tristan Rhodes — October 31, 2007 @ 3:34 pm

  4. its a complicated bug to fix, because when you edit a blog post the post rss feed gets republished and then the planet picks it up. Now the planet could store a history of all the posts and not repost but then how do we decided when to stop storing the posts?

    Comment by earobinson — October 31, 2007 @ 4:04 pm

  5. Planet keeps a history. But your blog software should set a creation date and a last-modification date on the blog post, and NOT MODIFY THE CREATION DATE AFTER CREATION.

    Or you could just put up new posts when new info arrives, instead of updating an old post.

    Comment by Martijn — October 31, 2007 @ 4:25 pm

  6. Thats a major problem that should be addressed. What you can’t fix typo or other mistakes without looking like a spammer.

    Comment by cyclepromo — October 31, 2007 @ 7:54 pm

  7. If Martijn is correct and this problem is caused when contributors’ blogging applications update feed creation dates after post edits, then I don’t think it’s fair to call it a Planet Ubuntu bug.

    I can’t help with the hosted WordPress issue I’m afraid Roald, other than to state the obvious, which is that I’m sure such a comprehensive package will have an option somewhere to modify this behaviour? But then you suspect that yourself already🙂

    By the way, thanks for providing the heads up on the potential laptop HDD issues. Very helpful.

    Comment by Roger Lancefield — November 1, 2007 @ 10:17 am

  8. to Roger Lancefield :

    You are welcome🙂

    Comment by ubuntudemon — November 1, 2007 @ 10:48 am

  9. ok! my HD have a 1000+ Load_Cycle_Count per day (i use the notebook 10 hours per day), with this parameters:

    hdparm -S 6 /dev/sda
    hdparm -B 254 /dev/sda

    i reduce the Load_cycle_Count to 300 aprox (i want this number, 300*365 = 109500, 600000 / 109500 = 5.47 years)
    but if change:
    hdparm -S 6 /dev/sda with “-S 12” or more the Load_Cycle_Count is going down.

    i am using now every time the laptop_mode😀😀.

    grettings
    insulae

    Comment by insulae — November 5, 2007 @ 11:08 pm

  10. to insulae :

    * -S 0 means you disable your
    spindown time. This also happens when you don’t specify S and are using apm/B values between 128 and 254 including those numbers
    * -S 6 means you set your spindown time to 30 seconds
    * -S 12 means you set your spindown time to 60 seconds
    see : man hdparm

    I would recommend using -S 0 and not spinning down your drive.

    Your Load_Cycle_Count might not be behaving as a real counter (increments of one). You should look at your WORST and THRESHOLD and calculate when your WORST will reach your threshold.

    Please use this thread for further support :
    http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=591503

    Comment by ubuntudemon — November 6, 2007 @ 11:58 am

  11. In general people who want support or have questions should give at least the following information :
    * the age of your disk
    * Power_On_Hours (sudo smartctl -a /dev/sda | grep Power_On_Hours)
    * Load_Cycle_Count (sudo smartctl -a /dev/sda | grep Load_Cycle_Count)

    Please use this thread for support :
    http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=591503

    Comment by ubuntudemon — November 6, 2007 @ 7:27 pm

  12. The HDD problem is very complex. Its *not* merely the drive manufacturers fault. Its not merely a BIOS issue.

    The OS deals with power management, and if your OS allows a power state where things get shut off, ie, as claimed, default manufacturer settings, thats one thing. If the OS then proceeds to commit to braindead access on the drive, that is simply very bad implementation and planning.

    The HD manufacturers have not set *insane* settings. They don’t expect an OS that works in power saving stance – ie laptop mode to basically operate in an insane method of disk access for dumb reasons all the time, even when the OS and the applications should be working in a ‘power managed’ state.

    Seeing some in the Linux community trying to shunt the blame away from them, and onto BIOS, or HD manufacturers has been embarrasing.

    Its also not one issue. The whole thing is wrapped up in multitudes of gremlins on clunking drives, and parking/unparking, and indeed how the whole OS interacts in power managed states.

    The good news? This will result (hopefully) in some forward progress and improvements and thought about APM and ACPI and power management in Linux. It may also lead to people carefully thinking about their daemons and system activity in a wider sense.

    If the OS and tools, daemons and operations require constant disk access, then the OS has to take responsibility for correcting the power management on the hardware.

    People can either build things in a way that makes such access, or the OS sets drives to spin all the time, or more of the time.

    Comment by AdmV0rl0n — November 9, 2007 @ 2:00 pm

  13. to AdmV0rl0n :

    Thank you for your comment. IMHO this issue needs to be taken more seriously. That’s why I have been blogging about it (multiple posts). When I saw that everyone blamed Ubuntu for this I thought it was fair to explain that power management settings are not touched by Ubuntu (on default).

    IMHO this an issue of both too aggressive power management and unnecessary disk activity. See :
    https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/acpi-support/+bug/17216/comments/102

    Some bug reports about unnecessary disk activity. These bugs are possible contributors to the Load_Cycle_Count issue.

    * the commit interval for the ext3 filesystem should be higher than 5 seconds for laptop users
    https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/util-linux/+bug/160448

    * ext3 partitions should be mounted with noatime or relatime for laptop users
    https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/util-linux/+bug/160450

    * acpid : Log output far too verbose
    https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/acpid/+bug/31512

    * liferea might cause unnecessary disk activity
    https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/liferea/+bug/160460

    * thunderbird might cause unnecessary disk activity
    https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/thunderbird/+bug/160466

    * tracker : the index delay should be set to a higher value for laptop users
    https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/tracker/+bug/160468

    firefox might cause unnecessary disk activity when going to a new website
    https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/firefox/+bug/160513

    hddtemp might cause unnecessary disk activity
    https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/hddtemp/+bug/160621

    We need people to contribute to these bugs.

    Comment by ubuntudemon — November 9, 2007 @ 4:43 pm

  14. hmm, what would be considered dangerous? i ran those two commands for load cycle and temperature and they both stay relatively low for more than an hour.

    am i affected or not?

    Comment by catdog — November 17, 2007 @ 9:14 pm

  15. to catdog :

    If your Load_Cycle_Count would reach it’s maximum (by specification of your harddisk manufacturer) within three years of usage you are affected.

    Please use the support thread for questions.

    The bug :
    https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/acpi-support/+bug/59695

    More information :
    http://ubuntuforums.org/showpost.php?p=3733762&postcount=1

    The support thread :
    http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=591503

    Comment by ubuntudemon — November 18, 2007 @ 1:13 pm


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